First lets talk Terrex. The offering from Singapore for the Marine Personnel Carrier Contest. No disrespect to ST Kinetics or SAIC but I just don't consider it a serious player in this field. It is undoubtably the "highest tech" version and provides flat screen displays for the infantry in back, cameras all around for the driver etc. Nice to have's but in my mind not entirely essential. War wagon first. Pimped out APC second. Lets get the basic vehicle right first shall we? Then once the money flow evens out we can go back and upgrade them with bells and whistles. Think adding a beefier suspension lift with tires to your truck after you get it off the show room. Yeah just like that. Anyway, here is the latest news on the Terrex...
AN Irish-developed armour-ed vehicle has been selected for testing by the US Marine Corps which is seeking nearly 600 new armoured personnel carriers.The 8X8 Terrex armoured vehicle was developed in Ireland by world leaders in vehicle and suspension design, Timoney Technology of Navan, for the Singapore Technologies Kinetics company.One of the most modern armoured vehicles in production, it has exceptional mobility and agility using a Timoney suspension system.The vehicle, which has a V shaped hull to protect against mine blasts, can carry up to 14 troops or 11 tonnes of cargo internally.It underwent initial trials in Ireland and the UK before being shipped to Singapore for evaluation.It is now produced there and the Singapore Army has bought 135 vehicles, while another version is produced in Turkey by Otokar.The vehicle is one of four that has been selected by the US Marine Corps and manufacturers have been given $3.5m (€2.6m) each to deliver a vehicle for testing which will run until August 2013.The marines need 579 personnel carriers to fill the gap left by another vehicle – the so-called expeditionary fighting vehicle – which was cancelled after $3bn (€2.25bn) was spent in developmental funding.Read the rest at their site.
This brings me to the real meat and potatoes of this post.
What the fuck is General Dynamics going to present? Testing is happening soon and we still don't know what vehicle they're going to put forward. After looking at their portfolio I think I was wrong in guessing on the LAV II Demonstrator. Don't get me wrong, its still a possibility but I just don't have enough info to guess what they're up to. Here are a few of my theories.
1. LAV II Demonstrator.
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Maybe they will run with an LAV II Demonstrator optimized to swim in surf. It would make a bit of sense for the Marine Corps. Why? Because officials are becoming a bit alarmed at the weight of Marine vehicles. Additionally it would help with the supply chain especially since the Marine Corps completed a buy of LAV-25A2's. It makes sense but I just don't know.
2. An Amphibious Stryker Double V Hull.
If General Dynamics offers a swimming Stryker double v hull and the Marine Corps bites then the Army Chief of Staff would probably shit himself silly. It makes a bit of sense too. First they could leverage a win into getting the Army to buy a few to help them "make the turn" to the Pacific. Additionally the Marines could leverage the Army's supply chain to max effect especially if the vehicles have a great deal of commonality. Add the possibility of the Marines using Army specialty vehicles based on this mythical amphibious Stryker and you open the door to many possibilities...from an amphibious Mobile Gun System (if they can ever make it work...I still like the turreted gun systems from Europe but we'll cover that later) to NBC and Medivac and you have a major upgrade in Marine armor on the cheap. But we're talking about components and at the end of the day the Marine Corps can do that today. Still an amphibious Stryker is intriguing.
3. The other IFV. The Pandur.
Don't ask me to explain why but this is my current favorite for General Dynamics to enter into the Marine Personnel Carrier race. The Stryker is an attractive idea on the surface but in the end I just don't think it will be an effective swimmer. The Pandur is the European secret that GD can pull out and stun the competition. First except for the swimming requirement, the model operated by the Czech Republic seems to offer all the bells and whistles the Marine Corps is looking for. And while it isn't (to my knowledge) certified to swim in the open ocean, it seems like the easiest to modify. Additionally they should be able to win a price war with it. Not wanting to insult our Czech allies but if they could afford it then certainly the Marine Corps has deep enough pockets.
I left out the Mowag Piranha IIIC because quite honestly I don't know if its still being produced. Everything I've found on the web indicates that they've migrated to the even heavier Piranha V.
That's my guess guys. Its worth what it costs ya. We'll know in a couple of months when they line up at a Marine Base near you for swim tests.
If you want to read something interesting about this ,go to WIKIPEDIA and write «portuguese PANDUR»...
ReplyDeleteA few year back the portuguese army and the portuguese marine corps had a competition between the Piranha,the Pandur and the Patria...Pandur was the winner,with Piranha in secound place and the Patria in last place...
The contract was canceled this year because GD was behind scredulle and the Pandur proved to be much more expensive than originaly stated...
General Dynamics:F#cking Marine Corps around the world since 1982 :)
As you will read,the newspaper claming curruption on the contest...if i recall well in the tests the Patria was the real winner...
MPC confuses me. Right now an AAV platoon has I believe 12 to 15 AAV's to support a rifle company. Exactly how many MPC's will be required. Assuming it's about twice as many can a unit have 24 to 30 MPC's and still be organized as a platoon?
ReplyDeleteWithin a MEU is the MPC unit going to replace the AAV platoon, be an additional asset, or not deploy with the MEU? Has the Corp thought this through and/or made any public decisions?
According to the last CRS report from last week the plan is for about 570 each with IOC in 2020 and 2022. If ACV turns out to be affordable wouldn't 285 more ACV's do the job of 570 MPC's?
Doesn't MPC exist because the Corp couldn't afford enough EFV's? Do we know if MPC really will be affordable vis a vis ACV given the greater number of MPC's and additional personnel required to fill the same mission?
All this aside shouldn't swim capability for MPC be a main feature given the risks within ACV? Shouldn't it at least be able to replace AAV in case ACV fails? In any case does it make sense for a rifle platoon to require 6 or so APC's? Exactly how will the platoon split up to mount the MPC's? How valuable is it to keep the squad intact within one infantry carrier? Finally how exactly does adding additional classes of armored vehicles to the Corp actually fit in to a refocus on expeditionary warfare? What happened to trying to get lighter? Isn't the corp better served with a single type of armored infantry carrier and shouldn't that vehicle be capable of amphibious assault?