Seems like this trend toward electronic sights on pistols is really starting to take off. Might be time to take a good look at it.
I wonder if this is another civilian started move that the military will adopt?
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Having met Chris and had the chance to shoot one of his carbine crs, I know he wouldn't use it unless it was worth his time. I learned so much from his crs, from pouch setups (learned to love my war belt) to adding more good habits to my already well taught marine ones.
ReplyDeleteAs for civilian started moves, most find their roots in the military.
historically yes, most of the migration of new things has been from military to civilian. but recently its been the other way around. and i think it has to do with the way that the military is adopting more and more law enforcement tech into there training. think about it. every special ops team uses a stack when entering and clearing rooms...but think about it from a grunt point of view. if you know you're about to face an entry then if you even have one good rifle you can slaughter a whole bunch of people. you don't even have to be advanced trained to know how stupid stacking outside a door is.
ReplyDeleteyet the military picked that trash up from law enforcement.
think about the fashion statement (and i believe thats all it is) about wearing your weapon on your plate carrier. thats how law enforcement carries its backup, thats how civilian shooters started wearing there gear. it makes no sense for someone that is shooting moving and communicating...supposedly getting in the dirt, to place there pistol on there chest. it makes no sense at all but you had it done.
so yeah in my opinion, civilian tactics have been showing up in military places.
dude you are wrong on so many levels. the weapon on the chest orgionated from mounted operations. being inside humvees and mraps its easer to get at it then on ur waist or leg. iv been a cop for 4 years along with the army for 10. as a cop i have never ever seen a pistol or back up on the chest.
ReplyDeleteas far as stacks, have u ever entered and cleared a room. i have, with guys on the other side of the door ready to kill me. the stacked always worked fine for me. please tell me how u would clear a room not suing a stack?
dude you're wrong. we carry a backup pistol on our vest instead of the old fashioned on your ankle...where? in a holster underneath the armpit. the quickest reload is another pistol....i don't where you're law enforcement but you jokers are so old skool its scary.
ReplyDeletevehicle operations is just nonsense. most of the time you're talking about grunts that don't have the luxury of a second arm and guess what....they get there damn rifle up and in action. any way how would you mount the M12 holster on your vest? you wouldn't so you can't tell me that it came about because of vehicle ops. secondly, the M4 carbine was suppose to solve the operating in cramped spaces...like vehicles....
oh and lets talk about stacks. i said if you had a properly trained and motivated gunman on the other side. tell me if you'd stack against a former Marine, high on drugs with a couple of AR-15's on the other side of family dwelling in the US.
also, i know for a fact that US law enforcement is shitting bricks about the high number of returning combat vets that might return to a former life that included criminal activity...this time with training.
you're being arrogant, you're not thinking this thru and you're operating off a bunch of preconceived notions. you're not impressing me.
Stacks work. It's about violence of actions, we know they work threw training and combat (i know ive fought Iranian quads a few times). Most of the time thanks to our training the stack ia fluid in its transition from its cold to hot postion.
ReplyDeleteDon't know what gave you a bad taste but these tatics have worked for me in q very kinetic environment.
As for the m12 I've seen it mounted to a flack buT your comment is true not very many of us have secondary weapons.
And m4s unless your in tracks or lavs or a key billet holder in grunts you have a m16a4
i bet you didn't do stacks in the 'prescribed' manner....cause if you do it the US military's way then they're not dynamic at all but rather deliberate.
ReplyDeletehave u ever been in the military?
ReplyDeleteas far as holster on chest. i operate mostly in a Landcruser. i have a holster on my chest because it easer to get to. and im not grabbing my long rifle every time i get out of my vic. also most urban fighting your not getting down and in the "mud". i was in ramadi in 05 and that was a bad time, fire fights almost every day. you know how many times i went prone. never not one time. never had too, always had some type of cover to get behind, also have u ever had to get up and down in full kit (mine weight over 100lbs), your not doing it
lol.
ReplyDeleteyeah i have been in the military.
yeah i know what its like to get up and down in full gear. don't know a thing about operating out of a landcruiser but you're changing terminology on me. first you're talking about 'kit' now and that's how the Brits and Aussies and New Zealanders refer to their equipment. US forces talk about 'gear'...if you're in the Marines then you talk about 782 gear...forgot what the Army calls their 'kit' but you get the idea.
whats a vic?? crown victoria police cruiser or is that a british vehicle i'm unfamiliar with.
how'd you go from MRAPs and humvees to land cruisers? who were you with in Ramadi in 05.
i was animal company 2 platoon 3-103rd attached to 2-69 3rd id, stationed at camp corrigador when i was in ramadi.
ReplyDeletei call all my gear a kit, always have. im in Afghanistan right now with the army as a psd unit at ISAF hq and we operate out of up armored civilian landcrusers, along with allot of people in kabul. before that i was attached to a PRT and we operated out of MRAPS.
as far as Vic, that my friend is a police term for vehicle, and is commonly used by the army too.