The M27.
One of the Marine Corps recent purchases that's had me punching walls, howling at the moon and grabbing a big bottle of Southern Comfort for....well comfort. I never understood the reason behind it.
My thoughts on it in a nutshell? We were getting a modern day Browning Automatic Weapon and we've been down that road before. Additionally I thought that it duplicated the functions of weapons we already have in service.
Thankfully a little birdy landed on my window sill and set me straight. First the weapon is about precise suppressive fire. Next, it is suppose to allow the Automatic Rifleman to maintain pace with a fast moving Rifle Squad.
But the biggest issue I had was with the doctrine. A weapon was issued to Marines and it didn't have doctrine behind it? No "book" on it?
Despite my bitching this is still the United States Marine Corps. There is even a proper way to take a shit in the Marines so this had me scratching my head till the skin came off.
Now word has it that the Marine Gunners behind the push didn't want "paper" on the weapon because it might limit the Infantry Battalions on how they would utilize it. I get the impression that this one time (in my experience) HQMC was allowing Marines in the field to take a new weapon out and get creative. Impressive and quite unique thinking. Especially when it comes to small arms in the Marine Corps.
I'll temper my rage about the M27. There was more going on there than meets the eye. I'll continue to watch its use in the Corps with great interest.
With the M27 I can only improperly quote Pierre Spey, "Do not worry about how well or badly something does in test. Only count how it performs in combat, that is the ultimate test."
ReplyDeleteI talked to the Marines in the first line BN to recieve it and I heard nothing but glowing reviews from the Marines that carried through EMV and then into Afghanistan. Reliable, accurate and above all deadly.
In Helmand you routinely end up in fire fights at over 500 meters where your opponenent is shooting at you from a 1 foot by 2 foot murder hole. Those afghans have been shot at so much in their lives that smacking 10 rounds into their bullet proof out wall does not cause them to flinch they just shoot back with a PKM.
The M27 was well loved becuase of it's ability to change from a designated marskman rifle to full auto if necessary. Like i said, nothing from good reviews from the LCpl carrying it to the Company Commanders.
i can roll with that. the only thing i will ask is why can't we put it in the hands of all Marine Riflemen. the answer is money.
Deleteit would be grand if we could though...so its perfect for the desert fight. sounds like it almost fills the role of designated marksman as well as automatic rifle. thats nothing but good. i wanna see how it performs in the jungles next.
Is this not a case for fielding more M110s?
DeleteThat way the team gets a tool they don't have rather than one they already have (M4).
well i like the idea of a dual use weapon instead of a higher priced unique one. if the M27 in flex into the designated marksman role as well as providing a light squad assault weapon then that's just sauce for the goose.
DeleteHQMC are missing brain cells for not playing up that part of the story ...
The Army is accomplishing the same thing with the M4A1 and they'll do it with significantly less cost.
DeleteSure, the extra 2" barrel length might matter. And yes, HK's build quality is top notch, no doubt there. But at the end of the day, what is the M27 giving the teams that the M4A1 won't?
And in the meantime, a modular upper for the M4 would be a third of the cost of the M27.
I'd rather see the money be used to build on our legacy as Riflemen and field more DMR/EMR in the fleet (not just MARSOC). Reach out and touch the bad guys!
But what do I know, I've been out for a long time... You're seeing the light and I'm still scratching my head... Maybe as a post you can do the math and figure out how many M27s and M110s we can get for one F-35B? :)
I think it is a cool weapon. Haven't shot it and I am confident I will never have the opportunity. However why they picked this weapon has always confused me. Certainly it is easier to carry, than some other squad support weapons but I also have wondered if part of the motivation was a lot of door kick-down scnearios where you observed SAWs configured to be a bit more portable for close in? Just have to observe this. On the class curve I guess it is the least of the worries for the USMC in these times.
ReplyDeletei'm gonna do a quick post on it, but you're right on several counts. the M27 you might not fire but its just an HK416. if you have several grand laying around you can get one of those...same thing. as far as other options i was always fond of the singapore ultimax. almost as light (maybe it is) and a far higher rate of fire. and yeah. the M27 is the least of the Marine Corps issues.
DeleteMove the whole Corps over to an HK416 family of weapons?
Deleteits a thought. its also a blast from the past. the first M16's were fully automatic. only later did we get burst settings. the only thing that gives me pause is that HK is an asshole company and i don't know how good support would be.
DeleteI've shot it on a few ranges, dropped steel silhouettes at 300 yards full auto from the kneeling, very controllable, gas piston, barrel is free floated Harris bipods, holds sub 2 MOA. It can take M4 mags, but it wont cycle right at full auto with them (your fine if you shoot semi), there are special mags made by brownell they are brown rather than the standard green. overall an outstanding weapon.
DeleteInteresting. When I was in the IDF, we thought of using the Galil on full auto in a similar way. Same caliber as the rest of the rifles. Same range. The Galil came with an integral bipod, and a 50 round magazine was available. And the Galil was quite robust (and heavy, like the Kalachnikov). In the end, the idea didn't pan out for reasons I don't know, and we stuck with the 30 round magazines, took off the bipods, and continued to use the FN MAG 7.62 mm as our light machine gun.
ReplyDeleteMy first rifle squads TOE was with M-14's, we had an M-14 designated as an Automatic rifle, all it had was a selector switch and bi-pod otherwise it was just another M-14 for true Automatic rifle fire we carried the M-60 the M-14 was too light to fire sustained accurate auto fire by any but the most well trained Marines.
ReplyDeleteThe M-16 armed squads simply added a PoS bi-pod that clamped to the barrel and was useless, the only difference was the AR man had his M-16 set on auto while the riflemen were ordered to set for single shot.
Tactics were sound but the weapons were not.
I'd like to see the M-27 issued to all Grunt Marines as a standard rifle, the M-4 is for support, CQB and leaders and crew served weapons.
Caliber change is the one biggest boost for Marine rifles and MG's. We won't see that though will we?