Doug brought up a great point in responding to an earlier post. How many times have we seen an Attack or Strike airplane turned into a fighter? His point and I agree, is that historically its never been successful. Lets take a walk back in time.
This was the first joint fighter project. No. Let me clarify. It was the first naval interceptor and planned air force fighter. The USN tested and rejected it out of hand despite the strong protests of a diabolical SECDEF. The USAF accepted it but it served as a light bomber (to use the old fashioned designation) rather than a fighter. In the role for which it was designed it was a failure.
Tornado ADV. Again what we have is a long range striker that was re-roled into an air defense variant. It was a missile truck and most people acknowledge that it would have been dog meat in aerial combat against a Flanker or Fulcrum. Meeting Bear Bombers at range? Aces. Meeting a force of Migs or Sukhois coming in to deliver pain? Not so good.
Some smart ass will want to include the Sea Harrier on this list but again I push back and say that it was more an interceptor than an air superiority fighter. It was designed for fleet defense...the kill the archer scenario. How do I explain the planes performance in the Falklands? Excellent pilots that were the equal of any on the planet, the Argentinians fighting at the very end of their planes range and poor leadership of Argentinian forces. By the numbers the UK should not have won that war. The Sea Harrier helped but it was the pilots and not the plane that won that war.
Honestly in the current era I can find no contemporary examples of a strike fighter being turned into an air superiority airplane. Even the F-16, F-15, F-14 and F-18 all started out as air superiority platforms and then had their mission sets expanded to ground attack...not the other way around.
When the F-35 fails, it will be because they tried to take a truck and make it a Ferrari. A truck is an awesome vehicle, but a race car it is not.
Neither is an attack/strike/deep interdiction airplane a fighter.
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| FB-111 |
This was the first joint fighter project. No. Let me clarify. It was the first naval interceptor and planned air force fighter. The USN tested and rejected it out of hand despite the strong protests of a diabolical SECDEF. The USAF accepted it but it served as a light bomber (to use the old fashioned designation) rather than a fighter. In the role for which it was designed it was a failure.
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| Tornado ADV |
Tornado ADV. Again what we have is a long range striker that was re-roled into an air defense variant. It was a missile truck and most people acknowledge that it would have been dog meat in aerial combat against a Flanker or Fulcrum. Meeting Bear Bombers at range? Aces. Meeting a force of Migs or Sukhois coming in to deliver pain? Not so good.
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| Sea Harrier |
Some smart ass will want to include the Sea Harrier on this list but again I push back and say that it was more an interceptor than an air superiority fighter. It was designed for fleet defense...the kill the archer scenario. How do I explain the planes performance in the Falklands? Excellent pilots that were the equal of any on the planet, the Argentinians fighting at the very end of their planes range and poor leadership of Argentinian forces. By the numbers the UK should not have won that war. The Sea Harrier helped but it was the pilots and not the plane that won that war.
Honestly in the current era I can find no contemporary examples of a strike fighter being turned into an air superiority airplane. Even the F-16, F-15, F-14 and F-18 all started out as air superiority platforms and then had their mission sets expanded to ground attack...not the other way around.
When the F-35 fails, it will be because they tried to take a truck and make it a Ferrari. A truck is an awesome vehicle, but a race car it is not.
Neither is an attack/strike/deep interdiction airplane a fighter.
The Brits were also supplied with a new version of the Sidewinder missile that was rushed into theater.
ReplyDeleteCharley
ReplyDeleteTrue, but irrelevent, all missile kills were rear arc shots.
TADV
I like the TADV
It wasnt sexy, but it did what it did and did it very well.
Its easy to say the Flanker or Fulcram would have killed it, but thats not the whole picture, because any such engagement would be at the extremes of its range and would have been pushed to dodge missiles AND get home afterwards
Much the same as the Mirage/Harrier equation.
The extremes of the F/F Range
DeleteThe TADV had fuel for multiple charges, launches and break offs.
The F/F would be landing in Norway if it tried that
Thanks for the hat tip, Sol!
ReplyDeleteThe ADV was crap. Even during the first Gulf War, the ADV was delegated to rear echelon duty where combat was unlikely. Since then, the Brits can't replace it with Typhoon fast enough. While the ADV is little more than a missile truck, the Typhoon's got some serious WVR cred. Just google: "Raptor Salad"
The F-35 is just slightly better than the ADV in concept. Although it has the questionable advantage of stealth, it still depends on the same concept of early detection leading to an AMRAAM kill. If the AMRAAM misses or the stealth doesn't work, the furball is gonna be messy.
P-51 maybe? Especially towards the end of w2.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteMaybe the point is it's harder to build a good fighter/interceptor than it is an attack platform. Usually, fighters that weren't good fighters end up in the attack role, although a select few have done both equally well. But, like the Harrier, as long as you have good (but not best) planes, shouldn't the pilots more than make up the difference?
ReplyDeleteComing late to this party but it seems turning a fighter into an attack airplane is a whole lot easier than the other way around. The F-100 and F-4 (and F4U) come to mind. The Navy even tried the "BombCat" F-14.
ReplyDeleteI like to think of the F-35 as a modern version of the A-7. Nobody tried to think of it as anything but an excellent bomb-truck. Perhaps the F-35 should be re-named The A-35.