via Global Post.com
He said the service made difficult choices in its fiscal 2015 budget and five-year spending plan to protect the ramp up in F-35 production for that reason.This is why the Marine Corps is in the middle of its biggest procurement wreck and holiday in its entire history.
"The operation and sustainment cost is a bigger issue," LaPlante said. "It's the one that will say whether or not we can afford (the F-35)" in the longer run.
The Pentagon's chief weapons tester reported in January that the F-35 fleet was available for use an average of 37 percent of the time from late 2012 to October 2013, far below the minimum threshold of 50 percent and the program's goal of 75 percent. The program is aiming for 60 percent availability by 2015.
I've said before that the Marine Corps shelved personnel, the ACV, MPC, AAV Upgrade, JLTV and probably the CH-53K because of that Walking Dead cast member.
The trouble is obvious.
Even IF (and its a HUGE if..) they are successful in driving down the unit costs you then are faced with operation and sustainment...what you and I would call maintenance costs.
Unless they've waved a magic wand then these will be some expensive, hangar queens that continue to cost even after they enter service.
The Marine Corps is broke. More money will NOT be coming and every available cent is currently programmed for the F-35.
We're screwed.
Note: Operations and Sustainment costs...maintenance! I don't care about the stealth coatings Its about not only procurement but also maintenance and if maintenance is unaffordable then neither is this airplane.
i have doubt about operating cost because :
ReplyDelete-all engine, and airframe, have to go often in planned maintenance in LM plant : classic shema in civilian way of lowering the price but getting money from maintenance.
- the stealth paint don't like rain, and need to be re-done often. The paint use rare dirt, on which china as allmost a monopole.
- inflation : some percent per years
-upgrade cost : all F35 build will have to be rebuild, i bet the rebuilding cost is higher than new build cost. So,like in last modern fighter programs, all currently build F35 will be keep in an army depot, until money magically appears or stupid buyer (like saudi with first trench Eurofighter).
So the marine budget will finally buy another time F35. At the end you will have half the number of F35, for double price.
The F-135 is said to cost around $27m each and with an engine life of 2800h (?) the F-35 will consume three of them during it's service life, right?
DeleteOr do they overhaul them good enough to put them back in again and again?
They probably will use 3 different engine, because the engine himself will be upgraded / fiabilized.
DeleteBut just the transport, and the use of civilian engineer ( instead of military engineer ) to do the job will increase the cost, with time.
And, what about a stike in the plant ? All aircraft stop flying ?
Wow that must be news to the guys are Hill....
Deletehttp://www.hill.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123404875
Modern jet engines actually out last the airframes. The P&W F100 has no life limit. F100-100/200/220's get an over hauls every 4300 cycles and go out again, the F100-229 and F110-129's both have overhaul intervals of 6K cycles and no life limit. Some parts that wear are replaced but that is it. The F135's are currently scheduled for overhaul's at 6000 cycle just like the F119 and F100-229's.
However like a new power plants they will undergo frequent inspections to make sure nothing goes wrong in the mean time. Even the F100/110/404/414 are inspected every few hundred hours just in case. I know the USAF and Navy take oil samples after every flight, and scan them for metal particles. This will warn of a failing bearing so it can be repaired and not ruin a multi million dollar power plant.
The last of the USAF F-15E's came with refurbished motors. Mostly to save money during the "Peace Dividends" of the 1990's.
Regarding F-135 service life, I got the numbers from this article.
Deletehttp://www.aviationweek.com/Article.aspx?id=/article-xml/asd_03_06_2014_p01-02-669564.xml
"The fan crack occurred on Dec. 23 during accelerated mission tests (AMT) on ground engine FX648 at Pratt’s West Palm Beach facility, as the engine reached 77% of its required life, says F-35 Program Executive Officer Lt. Gen. Christopher Bogdan"
"The specific engine involved was the highest-time F135 in the test fleet, with 2,200 hr. of running time, or approximately nine years of service as a test engine. In terms of hours"
Do I misinterpret them?
You obviously did not actually read the article. That was a test engine and that part was already being redesigned.
Delete"The F-135 is said to cost around $27m each and with an engine life of 2800h " was no where in that article.
"the engine reached 77% of its required life"
Delete"The specific engine... with 2,200 hr. of running time"
So if 77% equals 2200h, what is then 100% of required engine life for the FX648 engine?
And the price is all over the internet. Ranging from $13m to $28m each.
I never discussed any parts failing.
Do you have any other official numbers for its intended service life I would be more then grateful for that information.
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteFirst you are combining 2 different statements from 2 different sources.
DeleteMilitary engine lifespans are measured in cycles not hours. If you power up an aircraft and go for a 15 minute check flight it is 1 power cycle. If the same aircraft then flies a 16 hour ferry flight halfway around the world it is 1 cycle. The same aircraft goes to red flag flies 1 sortie as a red bird, and in 90 minutes, used full combat multiple time and refuels twice to regenerate and land with 6 cycles in 1 flight. Power on take-off and landing power down is 1 cycle + 1 cycle for every additional transition to afterburner.
Lt. Gen. Christopher Bogdan said it was at 77% of its "required life" or about 4600 cycles.
The statement from P&W said it had 2200 hours on it.
You assumed you could combine these statement to make a fact. If that could have been done you think AV Week would not have done that?
As to the source the AV Week page is in the archives now. I do not have an account to get to it. The PDF P&W had with all its military engine spec and overhaul cycles also vanished when the F100 - 220 was extended from 4000 to 5000 cycle between overhaul.
Thank you for the explanation.
Deleteits worst than that. not only will we get fewer F-35's but we've canceled a bunch of programs that won't come back to pay for it....AND we won't get those programs fora generation or two.
ReplyDeleteI thought that old "stealth coatings don't like rain" myth was debunked years ago! Just look at the F-22! Then again the same myth persists about the F-22 despite the USAF stating several times this is not the case.
ReplyDeleteI don't know what any fighter program could be expected to do against inflation, that is out of their control. LRIP F-35s will be retrofitted with new components at planned depot overhauls but that doesn't mean they will just be sitting around until then. They'll be able to fly but the retrofits are necessary to achieve to full 8,000 flight hour lifespan. And there is no reason the cost to retrofit one of these F-35s should be anywhere near the cost of a whole new aircraft.
All maintenance doesn't have to go to some major depot. Like most advanced aircraft it varies on what needs to be done.
The F-35 looks to be a lot like the V-22 program. It hasn't gone as planned and won't meet the original lofty goals but it will be made to work and become a very useful asset. Of course the F-35 is a program of much larger scale than the V-22.
You cannot continue to blame every problem with Marine Corp funding on the F-35B. JLTV has been scaled back and delayed for the Army as well. Even before this the Marines were more hesistant than the Army about the program due to the potential weight.
The reasons for the CH-53K delays are debatable but if you were to argue that it was delayed to protect another program the most likely suspect is not the F-35B but instead further MV-22 procurement. ACV takes priority over MPC and it seems to me that the lack of progress there is primarily due to management and uncertainty over what exactly the ACV should be. The uncertainty is understandable to some degree. I'm sure there are those who still think a hydroplaning amphibious assault vehicle can succeed, and there is obviously some disagreement over how many passengers need to be carried. These are basic but important questions that need to be answered before the requirements can be written up.
Considering the amount of money the DoD (rightfully) gets a year there is a no acceptable reason the F-35 should bankrupt us as you claim.
what you're saying doesn't make any sense.
Deletelook at the USAF! they're killing the A-10, the U-2, several squadrons of F-15 and F-16's and they're even talking about sending the KC-10 to the boneyard.
so dude. really? seriously? the guy says himself that the services made some difficult choices to protect the ramp up for the F-35 so SPARE ME THE BULLSHIT.
i'm not mad just flabbergasted. the F-35 is aerial syphilis.
I think you have enough desert populated by aircraft, in USA, to understand what i mean.
DeleteThe first have airframes Weaknesses and won't be upgraded. Last of of them will perhaps be used for training but i doubt about upgrades : it's not how LM system works. Their only target is to get all money they can.
I Spoke about inflation because I reject the projected reduction cost : that don't mean i argument only counter the F35 : Problem could simply be the economic way of the world.
It's not because USAF say that stealth coating is fine that it's true : Each visit trap opened mean fresh painting because the aircraft need to be perfectly smooth. Just look at aicraft maintenance pictures, you often see paint patch.
"A report from the General Accounting Office, the investigative arm of Congress, said the coating quickly degrades and loses its "invisibility" when exposed to rain or humidity."
Didn't they say that the crews on the carriers will have to learn a new way of working because of the F-35C? Something about things must be kept cleaner and you can't allow dirt or grease to build up. All this on a carrier that uses deck parking and exposes everything to salt air and spray. I've seen pictures of a carrier with planes parked and chained down forward with waves crashing on the bow. How long with a 35C, or a B on an amphib, be able to take that and still be functional?
DeleteFabsther, the boneyard has always been there since WWII. The airframe you weaknesses you refer to are primarily with the F-35B. The biggest problem is related to the aluminum bulkheads used in the aircraft's structure, I'm not aware if the plan is to actually rebuild the whole aircraft to replace those bulkheads the finalized design, or if they will just be strengthened somehow. The latter has been done to different components of different aircraft in the past. I used to work for a company that was subcontracted to make some braces required to strengthen the structure of certain F-22s.
DeleteSolomon, we've seen these cuts occurring since well before JSF spending was stepped up to facilitate actual production and work towards fielding the aircraft. The USAF has tried to replace the A-10 with F-16s several times and in the '90s they retired the EF-111. Later in the 2000s they sent some 30 B-1s to the boneyard and retired the F-117. Many F-15s and F-16s were retired over these years as well.
Funding obviously plays a large part in all of this but so does aircraft age as well. All air-superiority focused F-15s were supposed to be replaced by the F-22. Yet that didn't happen and a significant number of F-15s have already encountered structural problems. The F-16 fleet varies in age due to such a long and large production run but we've been retiring older aircraft at or near the end of their service lives for years now. You can thank Clinton's "procurement holiday" for part of this problem where we have such a high average age across our aircraft inventory.
Of course over 2,400 planned fighters for the United States alone is going to be the largest military program in recent times. What do you expect? How is the alternative of multiple different fighter programs cheaper overall?
Yes the Marines have had to make some sacrifices for the JSF but the alternative is to give up their STOVL capability and they have repeatedly fought against that. Maybe if Washington DC weren't seemingly trying to run this country into the ground for over the past decade funding all of this wouldn't be a problem. Even now the DoD gets hundreds of billions of dollars a year and I'm supposed to believe we can't afford to purchase and field 2,400 new fighters to replace old fighters over the next 20+ years? Have we really fallen so low where we can't make this work? Despite the scale of this program it isn't exactly the greatest thing we've ever tried to accomplish as a nation.
Our government should be holding Lockheed accountable so they lose if the F-35 loses. If their CEOs or shareholders are so stupid as to hurt long term prospects for short-term gain we need to show them it won't work out. Yet regardless of Lockheed I expect all of the many government agencies that write up these contracts and review the work being done to do what they are supposed to do. When the federal government is as massive as ours there is simply no excuse for Lockheed or any other contractor to cheat us and get away with it.
Yet even if at the end of the day the overall program cost remained the same as it is now, it is downright unacceptable if we can't find the money.
Not just less vehicles or ships, less marines too.
ReplyDeletehttp://news.usni.org/2014/04/03/marines-prepare-smaller-force-due-budget-woes
That is an amazing quote about the B-2 from 1997 'fabsther' (how is it applicable to the F-35 designed for use at sea?):
ReplyDelete"WASHINGTON, D.C.: Can't stand the rain? You're not alone. Neither can the B-2 Stealth Bomber. The Air force admitted today that the fleet of famously radar-invisible planes ? which cost the taxpayer $1.5 billion a pop ? doesn't like going out when it's wet, because it damages the special radar-absorbing paint. A report from the General Accounting Office, the investigative arm of Congress, said the coating quickly degrades and loses its "invisibility" when exposed to rain or humidity."
http://www.wordola.com/wusage/degrades/p9.html
Author: /time Magazine | Title: THURSDAY: Stealth Bomber Ain't Singing in the Rain | 8/21/1997
Meanwhile in a parallel universe....
ReplyDeletewww.navair.navy.mil/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.PrintNewsStory&id=5590
'Superrhinoceront' what has a 12 year Super Hornet repaint cycle got to do with the F-35s?
ReplyDeleteNot sure what they paint the Hornet with but the Navy Depot did our F-4G's towards the end of life, The stuff was like vehicle undercoating, it was a nightmare to work on.
DeleteEndurance, effectiveness, affordability. I wonder how much it will cost to keep the stealth paint of the F-35C during 12 years in the ocean if it deteriorates every time it flies in a humid environment. Probably the repaint cycle will be very short.
ReplyDeleteThis is ridiculous. The F-35 stealth does not rely on paint. Yes it is painted but the stealth is manufactured into the outer mold line of the aircraft. This fact has been repeated often enough to be a commonplace fact. References other than this one below can be provided.
ReplyDelete"...8,000 hour stealth guarantee (http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2011/12/205_97236.html)
Randy Howard, Lockheed Martin’s director of the Korea F-35 Campaign, said that the F-35 was designed from the very beginning to be VLO and its stealth coating is resilient enough that the aircraft's radar cross section will not suffer after numerous day-to-day operations.
“You can even take a knife and hardly scratch the finish of the F-35,” he said.
“Given what we know, it comes with a guarantee of the radar cross section at the end of 8,000 flight hours. It’s essentially guaranteed to be a VLO for the life of the aircraft.”
Howard said even if there is a scratch, there is a tool that allows mechanics to quickly find the impact of the scratch and whether it needs to be fixed...."
Lockheed Gives a Peek at New JSF Stealth Material Concept by Amy Butler May/17/2010
ReplyDeletehttp://www.aviationweek.com/Blogs.aspx?plckBlogId=Blog:27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7&plckController=Blog&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%253A27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%253Ac61d80df-a87d-4909-8ae9-5b80e3609ae1
"...It is called "fiber mat," and Tom Burbage, executive vice president of F-35 program integration for Lockheed Martin says it is "the single, biggest technological breakthrough we've had on this program." He says that a new process to blend stealth qualities into composite material avoided the need for stealthy appliqués and coatings. Using a new process, Lockheed officials are curing the stealthy, fiber mat substance into the composite skin of the aircraft, according to Burbage. It “makes this airplane extremely rugged. You literally have to damage the airplane to reduce the signature,” he said in an interview with Aviation Week in Fort Worth. This top-fiber mat surface takes the place of metallic paint that was used on earlier stealthy aircraft designs. The composite skin of the F-35 actually contains this layer of fiber mat, and it can help carry structural loads in the aircraft, Burbage adds. Lockheed Martin declined to provide further details on fiber mat because they are classified. But the disclosure of this new substance comes at a time when Lockheed Martin officials are arguing that maintenance costs for the F-35 will be lower than anticipated by operators...."
The F-35’s Race Against Time | Nov 2012 By John A. Tirpak Executive Editor http://www.airforce-magazine.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2012/November%202012/1112fighter.aspx
ReplyDelete“...When it comes to maintainable stealth design, the F-35 represents the state of the art, O’Bryan said, superior even to the F-22 Raptor, USAF’s top-of-the-line air superiority aircraft. The F-22 requires heavy doses of regular and expensive low observable materials maintenance. F-35 stealth surfaces, by contrast, are extremely resilient in all conditions, according to the Lockheed team. "We’ve taken it to a different level," O’Bryan said. The stealth of the production F-35 — verified in radar cross section tests performed on classified western test ranges — is better than that of any aircraft other than the F-22. This, he went on, is true in part because the conductive materials needed to absorb and disperse in-coming radar energy are baked directly into the aircraft’s multilayer composite skin and structure.
Moreover, the surface material smoothes out over time, slightly reducing the F-35’s original radar signature, according to the Lockheed Martin official. Only serious structural damage will disturb the F-35’s low observability, O’Bryan said, and Lockheed Martin has devised an array of field repairs that can restore full stealthiness in just a few hours.
Dramatic Stealthiness
The F-35’s radar cross section, or RCS, has a "maintenance margin," O’Bryan explained, meaning it’s "always better than the spec." Minor scratches and even dents won’t affect the F-35’s stealth qualities enough to degrade its combat performance, in the estimation of the company. Field equipment will be able to assess RCS right on the flight line, using far less cumbersome gear than has previously been needed to make such calculations....”
wow.
Deletetoo predictable.
THE GUY HIMSELF SAID THAT MAINTENANCE ISSUES ARE PLAGUING THE PROGRAM AND THAT WHETHER THEY COULD IMPROVE AVAILABILITY AND GET COSTS DOWN WOULD DETERMINE WHETHER THE PLANE WAS AFFORDABLE.
so what do you do? you focus in on the stealth coating that none of us know shit about and ignore the fact that this plane has a 37% availability rate....its ALIS system doesn't work...many of the airplanes already built are going to have to be rebuilt...etc...
Solomon, you should know about the F-35's stealth coatings and its capabilities.
DeleteFirst, these are the newest techniques of applying RAM coatings on a 5th generation fighter, where it is using fiber-mat coatings instead of a shit stealth paint used on the B-2 Spirit and the F-22A Raptor.
Second, it is much more easier for maintainers to maintain the F-35 Lightning IIs (still harder than 4th generation fighters due to stealth coatings) because of the LM engineers learning the principles of the stealth technology, where the maintenance on the F-117 Nighthawk was a nightmare and costly to those maintainers and the budget of USAF respectively.
Third, it has the most advanced avionics in the world, the way its systems function as shit was like the ones the F-22A Raptor suffered during testing, and it is a combination of both the F-16 and the F-18 SH, with its instantaneous turn rate and the sustained turn rate respectively on the F-35's performance, thus making the plane maneuverable on high speeds.
Forth, and lastly, we don't know about the classified information the F-35 program has, and I don't give shit about people giving ideas on how the program will fail, some of those are idiots that are influenced by Carlo Kopp, some are Russian douchebags that give nothing but overstatement of their planes.
Solomon, sometimes you don't clearly think about how people would do with things like this, you simply ignore things like how Kopp ignores the parasitic drag of external load on the Su-35BM at supersonic speeds in confronting the F-35.
I NEVER SAID ONE THING ABOUT THE F-35'S STEALTH COATING YOU STUPID FUCK.
Deletei repeated what the govt guy said. this thing is a maintenance hog.
stop reading into things and get what i'm actually saying....
@Leo
DeleteThe F-35 should not be called a 5th gen fighter as it does not fulfill the criteria.
The F-35 IS a maint hog.
Extremely poor availability rate.
Extremely poor sortie rate.
Extremely poor turn around time.
Extremely long 5 hour pre flight check just to make sure it works before take off.
Extremely long _average_ of 52 hours engine replacement time! FFS, a four man crew does it in 45 minutes on a Gripen outdoor on an austere forrest road.
What does the most advanced avionics actually matter when the aircraft is more of a hangar queen then an air superiority fighter. Not so much superiority at all actually. Barely a fighter to be honest with its slow, fat and draggy design.
And regarding "classified information" - if the F-35 would be this amazing stealth fighter surpassing every part of its ORD we would hear of it every day. From US military and from LockMart. But we don't.
What we do hear is report after report of how its requirements have been lowered. How late it is. How a piss poor number is hailed as amazing when it's a fraction better then the year before but still off from what it should be, by hundreds of percent.
The F-35 projects consumes so much budget every other part of defense will has to be sacrificed and this is many years before the fighter is reaching it's final milestone.
And then the actual maint hog will begin to show its real snout.
My repsonse has been so far to the 'fabsther' claim about 'stealth maintainability'. In first post of this thread 'fabsther' said: "i have doubt about operating cost because : ... - the stealth paint don't like rain, and need to be re-done often. The paint use rare dirt, on which china as allmost a monopole....". Then 'nukefromorbit' repsonded in part. Then 'fabsther' came back with: "It's not because USAF say that stealth coating is fine that it's true : Each visit trap opened mean fresh painting because the aircraft need to be perfectly smooth. Just look at aicraft maintenance pictures, you often see paint patch. "A report from the General Accounting Office, the investigative arm of Congress, said the coating quickly degrades and loses its "invisibility" when exposed to rain or humidity." -After- my first post 'unknown' came up with a post about F-35s being at sea on deck (which I have not responded to - keeping my response to 'fabster'). Then 'Superrhinoceront' came up with a completely irrelevant link to Super Hornet repainting every 12 years. Probably my references have already covered any response to 'unknown'.
ReplyDeletethat wasn't directed at you SpazSinbad.
Deletei was happy to watch the debate about the stealth coatings. it was heading off onto a tangent but i didn't mind and enjoyed following the links.
however Leo calls me by name and then wants to lecture me?
WTF!
that ain't happening. so no, you weren't the target of that. Leo was.
OK - fair enough. In response to this 'unknown' post: "Didn't they say that the crews on the carriers will have to learn a new way of working because of the F-35C? Something about things must be kept cleaner and you can't allow dirt or grease to build up. All this on a carrier that uses deck parking and exposes everything to salt air and spray. I've seen pictures of a carrier with planes parked and chained down forward with waves crashing on the bow. How long with a 35C, or a B on an amphib, be able to take that and still be functional?"
ReplyDeleteYES. I saw a video of a conference with USN senior pilots/ test pilots commenting on this 'at sea' aspect which not only referenced 'stealth' but all aspects of F-35B/C maintainability. There is a lot of new stuff for maintainers/pilots to learn about the aircraft for sure. However to bore you with another long ago quote - the stealth for the F-35s was designed from the start to be robust for 'at sea' use. Sure the aircraft will have to be washed more often and I'll guess the pilots will be involved in this exercise as well. As for 'waves crashing over the bow' - yep that does happen. And again the F-35s are designed with lessening the corrosive effects of the sea environment - which again also benefits the F-35s ashore. The F135 engine is so well corrosion proofed that it is used on both the A & C models - necessarily the B has an engine suitable not only for sea but for STOVL.
"F-35C STEALTH ON THE CARRIER DECK MEANS HIGH PERFORMANCE, LOW MAINTENANCE
FORT WORTH, Texas, March 18th, 2008 -- The U.S. Navy’s version of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II is scheduled to make its first flight next year, but technicians have spent the last decade perfecting the aircraft’s stealth design and materials to ensure they stand up to harsh carrier-deck and combat conditions with very little upkeep.
“The F-35C’s stealth will bring a profound increase in capability to the Navy’s fighter fleet. What it will not bring is increased maintenance,” said Steve O’Bryan, a former carrier fighter pilot and director of F-35 Domestic Business Development for Lockheed Martin. “The Lightning II is a 5th generation fighter with supportable stealth that was designed into the aircraft from the very beginning. It will endure extreme abuse without degrading its stealth radar-signature performance.”...
...“Even operating in harsh carrier-deck conditions, the F-35C will require no special care or feeding. In fact, its stealth adds very little to the day-today maintenance equation,” O’Bryan said. “We’ve come a long way from the early stealth airplanes, which needed hours or even days of attention and repair after every flight. The F-35 not only avoids that intensive level of upkeep, it will require significantly less maintenance than the non-stealth fighters it is designed to replace.”
http://www.jsf.mil/news/documents/20080318LM_CARRIER.rtf
How credible do you think it is to quote the F-35 Joint Program Office?
DeleteThey and Lock-Mart have been wrong on almost everything they've claimed about the F-35, and now we should believe what they say about stealth?
'Zapaton Maximo' how credible is it then? JPO and LockMart have done well enough so far - with some well known caveats - yet there they go despite your misgivings.
ReplyDeleteI like this : F35C still don't land fine on CVN, so it hasn't operated all along on it like the two other verrsions. BUT it is already better than every aircraft seen on carriers...
DeleteI can't understand that.
Now they advertise about Concurrent Develloping, which in fact trap the client to his command and ensure LM to get always more money, before the product is ready.
The commission that investigate contract like your GAO, or our "Cours des comptes", always get the truth between advertisement, non-said, and lies.
The thing is I saw a vid of the main conceptor of F16, which said that stealth came too late, and both russia and china had taken counter-mesure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_vXqtCkVy8
So, IF, and I believe it, it's true, stealth is irrelevant, for the price of 20000 Rafale( Even more considering only build price), you will have at best 2000 F35 ? Poorer fighter than rafale, F18 UH, or even 4th gen upgraded ?
Even worse, almost all airforce in EU will disband their entire army to get 40 F35 each ? even less !
If you had bought 20000 Rafale, No enemy could have enough missile get them all, trought SPECTRA ( which already proven to pass trought S300 PMU 1).
The Fatale didn't pass trough nothing. They Just start the war in Libya in a cold spot destroying symbolically 4 LAVs. Exactly as in the show games when the mayor of the city makes the first play.
ReplyDeleteThe Americans and British started the real game with their Tomahawks and then the USNavy sent the Growlers to allow the rest of the coalition (including the french) to destroy the remaining Libyan defences and army.
Paint system wins award for Wright-Patt F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program 21 Apr 2014 Barrie Barber
ReplyDeletehttp://www.daytondailynews.com/news/business/paint-system-wins-award-for-wright-patt-f-35-joint/nfd7s/
“...The AFLCMC office oversaw the development of a new paint applying system that reduced the number of coatings needed on the stealth jet, increased the amount of time paint can last, reduced hazardous emissions and improved fuel efficiency, among other outcomes, the Defense Department said.
The F-35 Joint Program Office estimated the new procedure could save $435 million in production costs and nearly $1.1 billion in operations and maintenance expenses over the life of the jet fighter.”
Jet Wash Onboard CVN [aircrew are climbing down while wash has started already]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oz1OJzcNoFs