U.S. officials confirmed Tuesday the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) has been holding a young American woman hostage for more than a year, and is demanding a ransom of $6.6 million.This is interesting on several levels.
The 26-year-old woman was working with several humanitarian aid groups, when she was kidnapped in Syria last year, CBS News reports. ISIS is demanding the $6.6 million ransom and the release of an MIT-trained neuroscientist, Aafia Siddiqui, who was convicted of attempting to kill U.S. officials in 2010.
She and the two other American hostages held by ISIS have been threatened with death since American journalist James Foley was executed, ABC News reports. One of the hostages, writer Steven Sotloff, was indicated as the next victim in the video of Foley’s execution, if Obama doesn’t stop bombing the terror group.
First, what will be the "conventional wisdom" if this woman is shown to be raped and then killed on YouTube? Will that demand we go to war?
Second, what is the responsibility of American's when they travel to foreign lands? Especially war zones? I haven't checked but I assume that the State Dept put out advisory's about going to the hot spots dotting the planet. Is the country responsible for those citizens that go anyway? Should we be risking the lives of our personnel in rescue attempts for people that do stupid stuff?
I wonder.
Where does self responsibility end and national security begin?
Well, how many american citzens ISIS have in their custody?
ReplyDeleteCan't the US government just deny their citzens to go to a place like that?
Saw this earlier on facebook
http://abcnews.go.com/US/secret-service-aware-apparent-isis-flag-photo-front/story?id=24985241
and about the dude that posted the ISIS flag on new jersey
http://abcnews.go.com/US/jersey-man-aback-isis-flag-flap-expressing-religion/story?id=24971471
Earlier, Globalization meant that "Money" would have increased flow and mobility across ventures around the world.....legal and illigal. Now even Humans have become as fluid as money when it comes to their application to ventures Legal and illigal.
ReplyDeleteWhether they are Aid Workers or deviant citizens bent on joining up with more troublemakers, their mobility is surprising governments.
As far as deviant citizens are concerned the concept of having your own citizens teaming up with your enemy isnt new. We have had "Turncoats" since the beginning of warfare itself. There are news reports that 4 Indians have also left India to join this ISIS movement. 4 seems an insignificant drop in the ocean when compared to the total polulation but drastic measures must be taken so that this drop does not become a flood.
And to control and take care of such deviant citizens, I am afraid to say that even democracies and pro-freedom countries will have to create a KGB/Stassi style origanization to monitor, detain/arrest and even assasinate such citizens or Turncoats.
DeleteAnd speaking of people leaving their countries to fight other people's wars.........Do you know that if a Swiss National joins the French Foreign Legion, he is to be arrested by the Swiss Government because of the strict neutrality policy of the Government that also extends to what its Private Citizens do....even if they do it it another country and not on own national territory.
If people want to fight for someone else who's not your ally, then let them. But do not welcome them back.
DeleteWhat you suggest would further the police-state the US is already developing into.
police state is getting misconstrued constantly. during the 1900 time frame you had many Europeans that wanted to come ot the US. we instituted controls. if you did not have skills that we needed then you were not allowed entry. if you were sick or infirm then you were not allowed entry. liberals today would call that a police state but that's just a properly working immigration system, not a slogan on a statue given to us from a foreign govt.
Deleteduring WW2 Nazi symapthizers in the US were locked up. others were hunted down. that isn't a police state that is simply acting to protect the nation. today if we did the same with Muslims or their sympathizers its called profiling.
a police state is totally different from what you're stating. people will get tired of this stupidity eventually and you'll see a revolt.
i can't wait. pass the popcorn cause its gonna be fun to watch.
And to answer the question raised by Sol:
DeleteA blunt no. They are there on their own free will, and they weren't forced to be there (like, say, Yazidis).
And we need a seperate "Legal Category" for these deviant citizens so that they are not automatically labelled enemy combatants. Their getting labelled enemy combatants paves the way for the Military to target them. And it is exactly this kind of operations that the Military must be isolated from. The operation of Killing Ones own Citizens.
ReplyDeleteyou guys are expanding the conversation beyond where i wanted it to go.
ReplyDeleteif a US citizen joins a terrorist organization then he becomes an enemy combatant and can be killed in the field or tried when he tries to return. but that's simple. you travel overseas and pickup a gun for the enemy then you're dogfood if a Marine, Soldier or pilot gets you in his sights.
but what about aidworkers that go to stupid places? what about journalists that go to stupid places? maybe its time to say you do stupid, you get stupid results and we won't save you. as far as getting news, its so spun and twisted that foreign journalist can easily fill the void and we can try and sort out on blogs or news pages.
In my view its largely the persons responsibility to asses the risk and make a choice. In this case she is an aid worker so she a purpose in being there which is something to give her credit for (she could be making a large amounts of cash at home, but she chose to do that instead so I have quite a deal of sympathy for her...the same for journalists.) Should she have gone, I will allow myself to be sexist her but I would be a little critical of the aid organisation for allowing her to go there (not knowing the back story, she may have insisted or that's where she was needed.)....I have an ex Australian Army friend who is now a doctor who worked with doctors without borders for awhile, I would be more comfortable with someone like him going to such a place, but that said don't know the back story. Should THIS be something a government gets involved with in a physical rescue with some head smashing, I would like to say yes just because I think its the right thing to do (but its not my family being asked to do it so I wont criticise a government for sitting on it hands), that said no money should change hands at all. Should it be expected, encouraged or go to war over....no....not when its a known situation (wide back 3 years when conflict was not a reality then the calculus changes). A little rambling...but I hope you get the gist.
ReplyDeleteso in your mind its ok for lets say...5 servicemembers to die in a rescue attempt because someone decided they wanted to be an aid worker in a war torn country? its ok for 5 families to be heartbroken because some idiot journalist decided that he wanted to cover the war in Iraq?
Deletei don't buy that type of thinking. quite honestly i say fuck that.
if she was convicted for attempting to kill US officials why would you rescue her ? How can she be an aid worker and be convicted for attempting to kill US officials ?
DeleteNo. These aid workers can do good work when it comes to natural disasters. War is a different matter. A lot of these individuals have socialist leanings and at university probably railed against Western imperialism, military power, and commercial power. Yet when the situation goes wrong they expect those facets of civilisation to rescue them from the savagery of the other. One day surely, hopefully, mankind (I refuse to be politically correct and use the word humankind!) will speak with one voice and follow one creed, but those days are along way away. Until then some here in the West, supposedly the educated perhaps too educated, need to learn the world is split into them and us. When push comes to shove them will always be themselves first. Are there no good works in the USA she could perform? It seems Western middle class young is a little too fascinated with Islam; it appears to be fashionable just as black rights were fashionable back in the 1960s and the 1970s. The difference being the latter was a just cause at home bringing together parts of society; a true wrong brought about us. Islam comes here out of choice and is different matter; they don't come as slaves with no rights; and they are more than happy to use our fairness against us. That some wealthy middle class take it one stage one further and go to these countries thinking them safe speaks volumes for their arrogance and ignorance. As does the fact they think can both embrace that culture and change it as the same time! (And still be welcomed.)
DeleteSavabar
ReplyDeleteThe point is, should soldiers be ordered to risk their lives to try and save the chronically stupid?
Soldiers die trying to rescue hostages
If those hostages are captured after failing to heed warnings, should the attempt be made?
(For the record, if you are sure you can pull me out at little risk, please do, otherwise, MOAB me)
Great question Sol!
ReplyDeleteI am so tired of this crap in the US where the "victim" is never wrong or it's not his or her fault! I have had people unfriend or block me on Facebook a few years back when that young, white American, Jewish kid got killed in Egypt. He thought it was a great idea to go to Egypt in the middle of a revolution and riots, protests and look around with some kind of notion of "helping". Am I sorry he was killed? Yes, sure! But do I have to feel like US govt should have done something? NO! My response, yeah, sorry, dude was killed BUT HE SHOULDN'T"T HAVE FREAKING BEEN THERE! Not my fault, my problem or my govt problem!
Sorry for Foley and aid worker, they knew the risks and they still went. Very admirable of them but no way should we pay a ransom or send SFs or SEALs to save them. Tough luck.
I travel a lot but there are some places I will never set foot, just too damn risky.