Thanks for the vid Andre!
Did you see all that unexploded ordnance? EOD is gonna have fun for years trying to clean that mess up. People will be dying for YEARS after the fighting ends.
Did you see all that unexploded ordnance? EOD is gonna have fun for years trying to clean that mess up. People will be dying for YEARS after the fighting ends.
Not good. I think we Europe are quick to say war here is unthinkable. Ethnic or sectarian hate is relatively rare here but it doesn't take much I fear before they become "then" and we become "us". Before the usual suspects turn up it should also be said that if the show was on the other the Western Ukrainians would be doing the same to the New Russians if they had the chance. Brussels and Washington went to war using others as proxies and somebody better at the game took out the proxies. Not good.
ReplyDeleteI would not determine Ukrainians as "western" side of country, quick look on map and we can clearly say that the loyal to central government are not only western part of country but central and most of eastern part also. The part that is occupied by pro-Russians (not new, middle, past... they are the same Russians as they were before, nothing new in them) is rather small part of two most eastern oblasts, we can even say they are east of eastern east.
DeleteI just wish the Russia would get a move on so we don't have see more of your tiresome posts excusing Kiev and their German and American backers. Are the two oblast to the extreme east of the territory? Yes. Therefore by definition everything else is to the west. If the Ukrainian Army had anything about it it would go to Kiev and string up the government for the good of the country and its people.
DeleteGerman and American? So the Brits were standing around not consulted or involved and they're simply victims in all this?
DeleteWhere I excuse any action of Ukraine government in my post or any relation to the city of Kiev? You are start to go in to paranoid phase of existence.
DeleteShas, just ignore Stepanya. If NATO would have relied on Englishman like him, they'd be speaking Russian in Paris and Liverpool. He hates Germans, not fond of Americans and apparently loves Russians, too. In Stepanya's world, if you aren't a John Bull, you ain't shit.
DeleteI guess somebody needs to define the meaning behind, "humanitarian corridor/passage". It's pretty obvious to me anyhow. No weapons, ordnance, military vehicles. I also heard that about a 1000 soldiers from the volunteer battalions trapped there walked away unharmed. No one's confirmed that, but seeing as how the commanders from the battalions are pissed at the Ukrainian Army for not supporting them, I guess it's safe to say it's true.
ReplyDeleteGrads seem to rule the battlefield
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKnFSzMefIY
Good catch Sol.
ReplyDeleteI have been watching the Vice coverage from the beginning it was good stuff. Very little of the actual shooting war is covered but usually the aftermath and the let the people speak for themselves. Especially with the airliner and how everyone viewed the downed airliner.
ReplyDeletei haven't been until recently. how they get these tiny little nerds to go into active war zones and get coverage that the main stream media is unable to get is beyond me. quite honestly this is journalism done right. these guys should win a Pulitzer prize but won't because it would cause too much embarrassment.
Deletebut have you noticed one other thing about there coverage? they just tell the story. they leave it up to the watcher to decide who's right and wrong. thats refreshing.
^ You mean actual Journalism?
DeleteI dont blame them for not getting mixed up in the actual shooting portion, im sure its straight hell trying to pick friend from foe at times and ichy trigger fingers can mean dead reporters.
good point. these guys are at the scene though doing what i see no others doing. its impressive as hell to me.
DeleteWell, you should watch the documentary about ISIS, and the one about Iraq. Both are very good
DeleteBest video I've seen on the whole thing yet. As you say, it's real journalism. Compare separatist Colonel "If we find guns/ammo, we will shoot you!" to the Ukraine troops in the next episode, and you can see a vast difference in their attitude and bearing. One side is confident, the other is demoralized.
DeleteThis is indeed very refreshing... impartial, professional, spot on.
DeleteQuite odd that I kinda of enjoyed watching their report for these qualities given what they were reporting, but that goes to show how terrible the other media sources are.
Solomon,
ReplyDeleteWhat you said about letting the people tell the story is what I love best about VICE. When someone is lying through their teeth they just let them go. They do not play "gothca" journalism and that is what I like. I really do want to hear what is the perspective of a separatist no matter what i think of his point of view.
Their coverage of Ferguson is just as well done.
Nice to know real journalism isn't dead although it has surely been put in the back of the class. I am going to make a point of watching these guys for some real news. Its also nice that the reporter assumes that the viewer isn't an idiot and doesn't feel the need to "inform" the viewer. Like you said, they let it speak for itself.
ReplyDeleteIf Sol will forgive the link
ReplyDeletehttp://theragingtory.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/ukraine-partition.html
5 maps, 4 electoral, 1 linguistic.
Theres a pretty solid divide on some sort there.
Now, that doesnt mean theres a solid majority support for joining Russia, but there is a pretty clear dividing line in the country.
And its a pretty big block of the county.
At this point the best Ukraine can hope for is to redraw the border on the Dnieper and a large scale population transfer. At least that way it keeps the remainder with a port.
An attempt to hold on to territory they cant control just lets Russia restart the fighting in a few years time
But the divide on maps had not translate in to support for rebellion. In first month of chaos, before the Ukrainian army was able to react there was chance to grab under Russian flag more regions, but this did not happen. Even Kreml did not try to push that rebellion further from two regions as it would not receive support there. What you think is the "best" for Ukraine in real it means the end of Ukraine. You propose that Ukraine give to Russia half of country, even if most of that half is under solid control and loyal to Ukraine. Then the mass relocation of people... this is insane.
DeleteFor now they try to fuck Ukraine in other way. Extort full rights for both separatist regions and then they will join in to Custom Union with Russia, in that case that will close the legal way for Ukraine to join the EU as they are already will be in some kind of Union. Even if both separatist regions will be formally still parts of Ukraine they will be part of Russian Federation.
Wilkileaks US cable from 2008 predicting things happening now.
ReplyDeletehttps://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/08MOSCOW265_a.html#efmAB5ACs
'''5. (C) Ukraine and Georgia's NATO aspirations not only touch a raw nerve in Russia, they engender serious concerns about the consequences for stability in the region. Not only does Russia perceive encirclement, and efforts to undermine Russia's influence in the region, but it also fears unpredictable and uncontrolled consequences which would seriously affect Russian security interests. Experts tell us that Russia is particularly worried that the strong divisions in Ukraine over NATO membership, with much of the ethnic-Russian community against membership, could lead to a major split, involving violence or at worst, civil war. In that eventuality, Russia would have to decide whether to intervene; a decision Russia does not want to have to face. ''
Thank you for posting this. I've been anticipating a Ukrainian civil war since the wikileaks "revelation" and I hate being proven right.
Delete