According to my local news (Israel) Jordan is moving all ISIS prisoners, including that woman who is the wife of...whoever, dont remember...to the prison facility where death sentences are carried out. If it was up to me, I would chose throwing them alive into pool of acid as the means of execution.
I understand the reaction but lets not sink to their level - nice and clean execution - line ISIS hostages against the wall and unleash barrage of bullets.
No reason to waste perfectly good ammunition on unarmed enemies. Hanging will work great too. Also, according to quran, muslims that are hanged cannot enter heaven. So its perfect.
Firing Squad with the bullets soaked in pigs blood and the bodies buried with pigs blood and organs covering the bodies. That way if their religion is right they will never be able to enter paradise. You must fight terrorism with terrorism.
I understand the reaction but lets not sink to their level I disagree.
Let muslims deal punishment the way their religion and culture dictates. Let the so-called "do good-ers" leave them alone. Them "do good-ers" don't have the faintest idea how the muslim religion works. Not every country, culture and/or religion can integrate with human decency well. "We", the west, are NOT muslims. Also understand that the pilot belongs to one of the strongest clan that help support the Jordanian monarchy/government. If the government does nothing at equal or harsher punishment then they'll get into bigger trouble with their citizens.
The last time the west intervened with the muslims we had Egypt and look what a fine mess Obama did. It's still a mess.
Sol remember when you had this bizarre theory that he defected to Isis ? Still think that now ?
"Which make me wonder if the guy didn't defect/sympathize/give himself over to ISIS....but lets put aside suspicion and assume its a legit situation and he merits rescuing."
Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"
This is rather interesting. So far, ISIS haven't really done anything that explicitly against Quran. They did a lot of things that are considered questionable by Quran and Sharia, but they were more like the very cruel and sadistic interpretation of the book. Now, burning - that is explicitly against the book. In no unquestionable terms, only Allah can kill with fire. Either they don't give a damn anymore (less likely), or it was specifically to instill as much rage in the Jordanians as possible, with hopes of Jordan descending into civil unrest and anarchy(more likely).
Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.' So far, ISIS haven't really done anything that explicitly against Quran. I don't think so.
So who are ISIL/ISIS fighting now. Fellow muslims. It's a re-brand of the Sunnis vs Shiites religious war.
ISIS/ISIS is just a large group of armed thugs which uses "religion" as a justification to kill anyone as they seem fit.
I am really tempted to put ISIL/ISIS in the same category as the Khmer Rhouge.
No offense to the veterans of the Iraqi conflict, but if the US had not intervened and attacked Iraq (the second time), then Saddam would've rolled these thugs. He may be a mad man or a maniac or a nut case but Saddam can sure clean up his back yard.
Whats done is done, and cannto be undone. Was Iraq thing and error - maybe, maybe not. No point in arguing now, except for purely academic reasons. We have the shit that we have. And for that matter, ISIS has been following the most extreme and violent interpretation of Quran. And while some of their actions were questionable, they still never went explicitly against the Quran. Yes, sometimes they had to shape narrative a little, had to interpret the Quran in unorthodox ways - but still, they never ever went explicitly against the book. Burning humans - that is forbidden. Only Allah can punish with fire. Period. No interpretations, no options. You can behead, torture, even rape if the women is not muslim, jewish or christian - but never burn alive. That is Haram.
You can behead, torture, even rape if the women is not muslim, jewish or christian - but never burn alive. And what is the term if a fellow muslim kills a group of muslim just because you don't fall in the same sect? What do you call people who misinterpret the holy book Qoran? (For those who don't know, the Sunnis vs Shiites secterian war is all about which one of the two is the "pure" muslim religion. Nothing more, nothing less.)
Call it how ISIL/ISIS want to call it. Once cannot say that ISIL/ISIS are "following the Qoran" after they've just beheaded another fellow muslim and/or raped a muslim girl/woman. This would be like Clinton saying to the Grand Jury, "sure I had sex, but I didn't like it".
Like I've said in my other posts/responses, you don't need to have religious or theological training. Without proper training, anyone can call themselves an "imam" or a "shiek" and can push his "flavour" or religious extremism to the level where we see now. Anyone with a d1ck between his legs can issue a fatwa.
PURPOSELY burning the Qoran is a no-no. PURPOSELY destroying the Qoran is a no-no. What do you call people who PURPOSELY misinterpret Qoran? If a non-muslim misinterprets the Qoran, you'll bet your a$$ there'll be a hundred fatwas issued against him (rightfully so). If a muslim mis-interprets the Qoran ...
There was a time in the old times when a person (or group of people) calls for the overthrow or armed rebellion against the government, the person can be charged with sedition. Nowadays, it's called "free speech". Go figure!
This can break a couple of ways, but Jordanians, especially down south around Kerak, take revenge pretty seriously. It was sending suicide bombers to Jordan that got Zarqawi dead back in 2006. The Jordanian security services don't tend to pick fights on behalf of the United States, especially when it'd make politics more difficult for King Abdallah, but this may lead them to take the gloves off both internally and over in Syria.
The Jordanian city where there've been photographs of pro-IS graffiti is Ma'an, which also in southern Jordan, the most pro-Hashimite part of the country. This might well lose IS most of its support there.
On the other hand, the brutality may convince the Jordanians to bail. I kind of doubt it. Unless the Hashimites are ready to abandon the country, they've got to win the showdown with IS and if regime supporters see that the alternative to supporting the Hashimites is getting burned alive, they'll probably move to the regime. The same kind of process is already happening in Syria and Iraq--the Syrian opposition kills a lot of Alawites for being in the same religious community as the regime's leaders, which pushes Alawites and IS in Iraq has killed a lot of Shi'a for being Shi'a, which has meant a lot of Shi'a volunteers for the militias that do most of the fighting up along the Iraqi government front with IS.
Unlikely. To bail for Jordan will mean to loose face. In terms of middle eastern monarchies, loosing face is as good as death, because that is what it will lead to, pretty much. Hashemites rule the country because they are percieved as strong. Backing down for Abdullah is pretty much signing his own death warrant.
Another option might be attempt to provoke all-out military response from Jordan. Jordanian military is allowed to act on its own accord, without asking the government - and if they see fit, against government and King's orders. Maybe it was to drive a wedge between Abdullah, who really doesnt want to get his country deeper into that shit than they already are, and military, who will opt for a strong response.
You got it. We've pretty much got our answer. Jordan's going to execute the suicide bomber that survived the Amman attack in 2005 (her belt didn't work). They're also promising revenge, but the execution is the real message.
he killed ISIS on the ground by bombing them.. and why should he expect leniency ? you mass murder your enemy from above and if you get caught you shouldnt be entitled to anything except a horrible end..
Come to think of it, maybe that's why OPEC is keeping oil prices low. The news goes on and on about anti-fracking, but fracking has been around for quite a while with no price drop, so why now? I suspect "international" news was too focused on the worries about the West and missed the worries of the people setting oil prices. ISIS is getting a lot of funding from cladestine oil sales, so by keeping the price low, they keep the demand and price of black market oil low too, cutting funding to ISIS.
When you got a rabid dog next door, your worries that you might lose your job next year pales in comparison to the threat of teeth around your ankles. While the Middle East may be worried about fracking in the future, I bet they're more worried about someone demanding the obedience of all Muslims on the threat of death just next door.
How could I join an Iraqi Army or Jordanian Army? Because I want to kill 10 ISIS and put a bullet in their head. Do you have any ISIS prisoners? Please let me kill all of them. ISIS is an evil a true evil.
Would you be any better? Same emotion just different target?
Don't hate them, just exterminate them.
Unfortunately, the world seems to shy from genocide these days, otherwise a clean sweep operation from one end of the occupied zone to the other would solve the problem fast.
On the other hand, I still see ISIS as a temporary problem. They burn bright admittedly, but utterly fail to bring anything a nation needs to the table. No production, no trade, recruitment is bad with them resorting to a "leave and we'll kill you" tactics to keep people from leaving. At best, all they can last for is 5 years before their "war or death" stance leaves them unable to function as a state at all. No water, no food, no production.
A new state needs a certain amount of goodwill and trade. ISIL does not have either.
tell me whats the difference in how pilot push a button and released ordnance to kill and maim people horrifically on the ground , with ISIS burning this guy alive ? How about the dead innocents caught in the blast of the bomb ? disfigured man and woman and child whose only fault is only because they stand too close to the primary target ?
the western media sanitize the war and it's victim and the western people totally missed the part where body parts lying on the ground after an airstrike.. and now they fot shocked over ISIS method of execution ?
i'd say this, they both cruel, but at leas the ISIS are not hypocrites like western military..
And pilots bomb journalists when they don't get paid 200 million.
You don't get it do you. One bombs because 1) it is his job and 2) he's trying to protect people. The other kills for money and for the fun of it.
If you can't see the difference, then calling you a village idiot really was an insult to village idiots everywhere.
And if I recall correctly, Jordan isn't in any way a "Western" country. Unless you want to lump them in with the Ukrainian "vassals" and Polish "stooges". Jordan is a vassal of the US. Wow. So Israel is a vassal of the US and Jordan is a vassal of the US. So when Jordan invaded Israel, it must have missed the message that they were on the same side...
What happened to the japaneses just proved that they want to exterminate everyone who is not in their terms. Muslims, Americans, japaneses, thaylandes, everyone...
@disfigured man and woman and child whose only fault is only because they stand too close to the primary target ? @ The last time I checked the west is against those kinds of killings too its called the geneva convention. You might criticize the western hypocricy when they call Assad a murderer because he bombs aleppo and turning a blind eye to the junta bombing of donetsk. But equating the sadistic murder of an unnarmed men in that way with the colateral damage of war has no founding in reallity, both are cruel but one of them is evil.
"Government spokesman Mohammed al-Momani confirmed to the Associated Press that Jordan had executed Sajida al-Rishawi and Ziad al-Karbouly, two Iraqis linked to Al Qaeda. Another official told the AP that both prisoners had been hanged. The executions took place at Swaqa prison about 50 miles south of the Jordanian capital of Amman."
"They're starting more sorties tomorrow than they've ever had. They're starting tomorrow," Hunter told the Washington Examiner in an interview published online Tuesday night. Hunter added the King also said: "The only problem we're going to have is running out of fuel and bullets."
I think this solidifed things with the Jordanians.
I was talking with my 17 year old son about these zealots. Somehow they think that taking the world back to 500 A.D. is the best. I may be wrong but wasn't Thomas Aquinas tasked by the Vatican to bring the "advanced sciences" of the Muslim world to the western masses in a way that was palatable to the Catholic Church?
How time progresses......back in the 1100-1200's, Muslims were the forward leaning thinkers of the time and the western world was backwards. Now, how times have changed.
When are we, as a civilized society, going to rise up against these atrocities and call it what it is? And then have the intestinal fortitude to do something about it?
Sons of bitches...
ReplyDeleteAccording to my local news (Israel) Jordan is moving all ISIS prisoners, including that woman who is the wife of...whoever, dont remember...to the prison facility where death sentences are carried out. If it was up to me, I would chose throwing them alive into pool of acid as the means of execution.
ReplyDeleteI understand the reaction but lets not sink to their level - nice and clean execution - line ISIS hostages against the wall and unleash barrage of bullets.
DeleteNo reason to waste perfectly good ammunition on unarmed enemies. Hanging will work great too. Also, according to quran, muslims that are hanged cannot enter heaven. So its perfect.
DeleteI'm partial to crucifixion. No nails, just rope.
DeleteFiring Squad with the bullets soaked in pigs blood and the bodies buried with pigs blood and organs covering the bodies. That way if their religion is right they will never be able to enter paradise. You must fight terrorism with terrorism.
DeleteI understand the reaction but lets not sink to their level
DeleteI disagree.
Let muslims deal punishment the way their religion and culture dictates. Let the so-called "do good-ers" leave them alone. Them "do good-ers" don't have the faintest idea how the muslim religion works. Not every country, culture and/or religion can integrate with human decency well. "We", the west, are NOT muslims. Also understand that the pilot belongs to one of the strongest clan that help support the Jordanian monarchy/government. If the government does nothing at equal or harsher punishment then they'll get into bigger trouble with their citizens.
The last time the west intervened with the muslims we had Egypt and look what a fine mess Obama did. It's still a mess.
Sol remember when you had this bizarre theory that he defected to Isis ? Still think that now ?
ReplyDelete"Which make me wonder if the guy didn't defect/sympathize/give himself over to ISIS....but lets put aside suspicion and assume its a legit situation and he merits rescuing."
http://snafu-solomon.blogspot.com/2015/01/socom-attempted-to-rescue-downed.html
Sol's Tea leaves were malfunctioning that day.
DeleteBlogger does not equal expert
Sol's Tea leaves were malfunctioning that day.
DeleteBlogger does not equal expert
Its legit,just watched...
ReplyDelete...fucking hell.
Spiritual Ebola is a good definition
ReplyDeleteVolume 9, Book 84, Number 57:
ReplyDeleteNarrated 'Ikrima:
Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"
This is rather interesting. So far, ISIS haven't really done anything that explicitly against Quran. They did a lot of things that are considered questionable by Quran and Sharia, but they were more like the very cruel and sadistic interpretation of the book. Now, burning - that is explicitly against the book. In no unquestionable terms, only Allah can kill with fire. Either they don't give a damn anymore (less likely), or it was specifically to instill as much rage in the Jordanians as possible, with hopes of Jordan descending into civil unrest and anarchy(more likely).
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteSome Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them.
Delete'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'
So far, ISIS haven't really done anything that explicitly against Quran.
I don't think so.
So who are ISIL/ISIS fighting now. Fellow muslims. It's a re-brand of the Sunnis vs Shiites religious war.
ISIS/ISIS is just a large group of armed thugs which uses "religion" as a justification to kill anyone as they seem fit.
I am really tempted to put ISIL/ISIS in the same category as the Khmer Rhouge.
No offense to the veterans of the Iraqi conflict, but if the US had not intervened and attacked Iraq (the second time), then Saddam would've rolled these thugs. He may be a mad man or a maniac or a nut case but Saddam can sure clean up his back yard.
Whats done is done, and cannto be undone. Was Iraq thing and error - maybe, maybe not. No point in arguing now, except for purely academic reasons. We have the shit that we have. And for that matter, ISIS has been following the most extreme and violent interpretation of Quran. And while some of their actions were questionable, they still never went explicitly against the Quran. Yes, sometimes they had to shape narrative a little, had to interpret the Quran in unorthodox ways - but still, they never ever went explicitly against the book. Burning humans - that is forbidden. Only Allah can punish with fire. Period. No interpretations, no options. You can behead, torture, even rape if the women is not muslim, jewish or christian - but never burn alive. That is Haram.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteYou can behead, torture, even rape if the women is not muslim, jewish or christian - but never burn alive.
DeleteAnd what is the term if a fellow muslim kills a group of muslim just because you don't fall in the same sect?
What do you call people who misinterpret the holy book Qoran?
(For those who don't know, the Sunnis vs Shiites secterian war is all about which one of the two is the "pure" muslim religion. Nothing more, nothing less.)
Call it how ISIL/ISIS want to call it. Once cannot say that ISIL/ISIS are "following the Qoran" after they've just beheaded another fellow muslim and/or raped a muslim girl/woman. This would be like Clinton saying to the Grand Jury, "sure I had sex, but I didn't like it".
Like I've said in my other posts/responses, you don't need to have religious or theological training. Without proper training, anyone can call themselves an "imam" or a "shiek" and can push his "flavour" or religious extremism to the level where we see now. Anyone with a d1ck between his legs can issue a fatwa.
PURPOSELY burning the Qoran is a no-no. PURPOSELY destroying the Qoran is a no-no. What do you call people who PURPOSELY misinterpret Qoran? If a non-muslim misinterprets the Qoran, you'll bet your a$$ there'll be a hundred fatwas issued against him (rightfully so). If a muslim mis-interprets the Qoran ...
There was a time in the old times when a person (or group of people) calls for the overthrow or armed rebellion against the government, the person can be charged with sedition. Nowadays, it's called "free speech". Go figure!
The one showing a kid killing two dudes is fake?
ReplyDeleteThis can break a couple of ways, but Jordanians, especially down south around Kerak, take revenge pretty seriously. It was sending suicide bombers to Jordan that got Zarqawi dead back in 2006. The Jordanian security services don't tend to pick fights on behalf of the United States, especially when it'd make politics more difficult for King Abdallah, but this may lead them to take the gloves off both internally and over in Syria.
ReplyDeleteThe Jordanian city where there've been photographs of pro-IS graffiti is Ma'an, which also in southern Jordan, the most pro-Hashimite part of the country. This might well lose IS most of its support there.
On the other hand, the brutality may convince the Jordanians to bail. I kind of doubt it. Unless the Hashimites are ready to abandon the country, they've got to win the showdown with IS and if regime supporters see that the alternative to supporting the Hashimites is getting burned alive, they'll probably move to the regime. The same kind of process is already happening in Syria and Iraq--the Syrian opposition kills a lot of Alawites for being in the same religious community as the regime's leaders, which pushes Alawites and IS in Iraq has killed a lot of Shi'a for being Shi'a, which has meant a lot of Shi'a volunteers for the militias that do most of the fighting up along the Iraqi government front with IS.
Unlikely. To bail for Jordan will mean to loose face. In terms of middle eastern monarchies, loosing face is as good as death, because that is what it will lead to, pretty much. Hashemites rule the country because they are percieved as strong. Backing down for Abdullah is pretty much signing his own death warrant.
DeleteAnother option might be attempt to provoke all-out military response from Jordan. Jordanian military is allowed to act on its own accord, without asking the government - and if they see fit, against government and King's orders. Maybe it was to drive a wedge between Abdullah, who really doesnt want to get his country deeper into that shit than they already are, and military, who will opt for a strong response.
You got it. We've pretty much got our answer. Jordan's going to execute the suicide bomber that survived the Amman attack in 2005 (her belt didn't work). They're also promising revenge, but the execution is the real message.
DeleteWell, It´s clear to whoever is fighting ISIS that surrender is not an option... Would Mr. Bowe Bergdahl surrender to ISIS?
ReplyDeletehe killed ISIS on the ground by bombing them.. and why should he expect leniency ? you mass murder your enemy from above and if you get caught you shouldnt be entitled to anything except a horrible end..
ReplyDeletelive by the sword , die by the sword
And the journalist should have been penned to death?
DeleteOr the other hundreds who had nothing but the bad luck to live in Aleppo when the ISIS took control? Or Mosul?
Sometimes your stupidity exceeds itself.
Sometimes...?
DeleteI'm sure he has his moments of genius when we are not looking.
DeleteDo you really believe that?
Delete"There are no words to express my hatred"
ReplyDeleteYes there are... Kill them all.
Medieval zealots.
ReplyDeleteCome to think of it, maybe that's why OPEC is keeping oil prices low. The news goes on and on about anti-fracking, but fracking has been around for quite a while with no price drop, so why now? I suspect "international" news was too focused on the worries about the West and missed the worries of the people setting oil prices. ISIS is getting a lot of funding from cladestine oil sales, so by keeping the price low, they keep the demand and price of black market oil low too, cutting funding to ISIS.
ReplyDeleteWhen you got a rabid dog next door, your worries that you might lose your job next year pales in comparison to the threat of teeth around your ankles. While the Middle East may be worried about fracking in the future, I bet they're more worried about someone demanding the obedience of all Muslims on the threat of death just next door.
I think we missed an opportunity to negotiate with moderate Nazis in WWII.
ReplyDeleteHow could I join an Iraqi Army or Jordanian Army? Because I want to kill 10 ISIS and put a bullet in their head. Do you have any ISIS prisoners? Please let me kill all of them. ISIS is an evil a true evil.
ReplyDeleteWould you be any better? Same emotion just different target?
DeleteDon't hate them, just exterminate them.
Unfortunately, the world seems to shy from genocide these days, otherwise a clean sweep operation from one end of the occupied zone to the other would solve the problem fast.
On the other hand, I still see ISIS as a temporary problem. They burn bright admittedly, but utterly fail to bring anything a nation needs to the table. No production, no trade, recruitment is bad with them resorting to a "leave and we'll kill you" tactics to keep people from leaving. At best, all they can last for is 5 years before their "war or death" stance leaves them unable to function as a state at all. No water, no food, no production.
A new state needs a certain amount of goodwill and trade. ISIL does not have either.
Found this on my Timeline. Possibly the actual footage of Jordanian pilot being Burned.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf-MOS8_Dxg&feature=youtu.be
tell me whats the difference in how pilot push a button and released ordnance to kill and maim people horrifically on the ground , with ISIS burning this guy alive ? How about the dead innocents caught in the blast of the bomb ? disfigured man and woman and child whose only fault is only because they stand too close to the primary target ?
ReplyDeletethe western media sanitize the war and it's victim and the western people totally missed the part where body parts lying on the ground after an airstrike.. and now they fot shocked over ISIS method of execution ?
i'd say this, they both cruel, but at leas the ISIS are not hypocrites like western military..
And pilots bomb journalists when they don't get paid 200 million.
DeleteYou don't get it do you. One bombs because 1) it is his job and 2) he's trying to protect people. The other kills for money and for the fun of it.
If you can't see the difference, then calling you a village idiot really was an insult to village idiots everywhere.
And if I recall correctly, Jordan isn't in any way a "Western" country. Unless you want to lump them in with the Ukrainian "vassals" and Polish "stooges". Jordan is a vassal of the US. Wow. So Israel is a vassal of the US and Jordan is a vassal of the US. So when Jordan invaded Israel, it must have missed the message that they were on the same side...
We need to apologize to all village idiots now.
What happened to the japaneses just proved that they want to exterminate everyone who is not in their terms. Muslims, Americans, japaneses, thaylandes, everyone...
DeleteYou just realized it now? No radical Muslim can stay in close proximity to "unbelievers" without trying to kill them.
Delete@disfigured man and woman and child whose only fault is only because they stand too close to the primary target ? @ The last time I checked the west is against those kinds of killings too its called the geneva convention. You might criticize the western hypocricy when they call Assad a murderer because he bombs aleppo and turning a blind eye to the junta bombing of donetsk. But equating the sadistic murder of an unnarmed men in that way with the colateral damage of war has no founding in reallity, both are cruel but one of them is evil.
Deletehttp://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/02/04/jordan-hangs-2-al-qaeda-prisoners-after-isis-video-shows-jordanian-pilot-burned/
ReplyDelete"Government spokesman Mohammed al-Momani confirmed to the Associated Press that Jordan had executed Sajida al-Rishawi and Ziad al-Karbouly, two Iraqis linked to Al Qaeda. Another official told the AP that both prisoners had been hanged. The executions took place at Swaqa prison about 50 miles south of the Jordanian capital of Amman."
"They're starting more sorties tomorrow than they've ever had. They're starting tomorrow," Hunter told the Washington Examiner in an interview published online Tuesday night. Hunter added the King also said: "The only problem we're going to have is running out of fuel and bullets."
I think this solidifed things with the Jordanians.
I was talking with my 17 year old son about these zealots. Somehow they think that taking the world back to 500 A.D. is the best. I may be wrong but wasn't Thomas Aquinas tasked by the Vatican to bring the "advanced sciences" of the Muslim world to the western masses in a way that was palatable to the Catholic Church?
How time progresses......back in the 1100-1200's, Muslims were the forward leaning thinkers of the time and the western world was backwards. Now, how times have changed.
When are we, as a civilized society, going to rise up against these atrocities and call it what it is? And then have the intestinal fortitude to do something about it?